Wow! Very well written! I tend to see both sides of the fence so to
speak, and as someone in the less than 100 finds/plants group, I
would either need a ton of money for traveling or the ability to
move out to a state/area with more than a few randomly spread out
boxes to even come close to some of the outragous numbers I have
seen posted. So for me, it looks like I will always be bringing up
the rear... I am happy for all these people who have found/planted
so many boxes and they do have a right to brag about their numbers,
but with numbers like those, I often feel very inadaquate in the
letterboxing community "rat race". As for the drive-bys, I tend to
like having them, as long as it isn't every box out there. These
boxes are good for kids to learn the hobby and not be tired halfway
up the mountain, but I do wish there were more boxes with longer and
more involved trails. Letterboxing is what you make of it and there
should be no standards, other than respecting the nature around you
while you are on your boxing journey. Not only do letterboxES come
in all shapes ad sizes, letterboxERS do to. If drive-bys don't
appeal to you, just skip them. Ten mile hikes don't appeal to me
because I always have kids with me, so I just skip those altogether.
But hey, that's just my two cents.

Liz

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "allaboutthehike"
wrote:
>
>
> Well,
> I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am with the
> response to the PFX:500 club. What I am amazed with
> is that people still look at this whole thing as a
> contest. I guess the phrase "So what do I win?"
> when explaining this hobby to possible newbies will
> always rear it's ugly head. With numbers like 3000
> in Connecticut alone, 7000 finds, 100 finds in every
> state it's hard for a new person to "get" the whole
> concept of letterboxing. Especially when the
> "quintessential" letterboxers start competitions. Is
> it really still all about the hike or has it become
> something different? If that is the reality, then who
> are we to blame for this beautiful hobby becoming a
> stamp hoarding contest? Did the "founding fathers"
> mean for it to turn out this way? I think not. When
> did it start becoming all about the numbers? Remember
> when the person who had 13 boxes had the most in the
> U.S.? Has anyone ever READ the archives. Not looked
> at.....I mean READ. If this is the path that
> letterboxing is taking then maybe someone should "take
> the helm" so to speak, and bring back the old school
> methods. DRIVE BYES STINK. In case anyone beside me
> was wondering what the point of those are. Oh that's
> right....It's all about the numbers!!!!
>
> To the "higher ups": Stop scaring people away with
> dictating what the standards are. The are no
> "distinctions." We're all a bunch of wackos walking
> through the woods looking like we're lost. With 7000
> finds are you not one of the wackos anymore? If not,
> then what has it become for you? Playing a game
> shouldn't be like the rat race, should it?
>
> All about the hike

~Sigh~

I'm sure everyone will agree that the hobby of letterboxing attracts people
to it for different reasons. Some people religiously count their boxes,
others religiously don't. Some are in it for the hike, others for the art,
others for the hunt, others for the camaraderie. I know 'boxers who don't
plant or find, they just carve stamps and give their stamps to others to
plant. For some 'boxers I know it IS about the numbers and who gets there
first and they take pleasure in sharing their accomplishments. I must say,
however, that I have not met one person for whom this hobby is a contest or
a competition with other 'boxers. I think perhaps that folks who feel
pressure may be inferring something that it not being implied.

I say this particularly because the post that I am assuming All About the
Hike is referring to was penned by a person who is the most prolific of
boxers, yes, but is also someone who joyously cheers on EVERYONE regardless
of whether they have 1 find or 1000, whether they as passionate about hiking
as she is or whether they crave the next drive-by. I know the post came
from a joy of relating the story (and the encouragement some of us have
given her to share her stories) and not the desire to boast about numbers.

I am terribly frustrated by the response to her post, because it seems that
every time she posts about her forays, she gets flack because of the number
of boxes found or the extent of her travels. You talk about "the higher ups"
or "old timers" scaring people away from the list or the hobby, but it is
exactly this type of reaction that has made this person repeatedly feel like
somewhat of a pariah in a hobby she adores.

I would encourage people who don't want it to "be about the numbers" to not
MAKE it about the numbers. That is, don't let the numbers of others get to
you. I just remember what my mother taught me as a child...to be proud of
myself and not to seek my worth or happiness in others but within myself.
The people who have found the high numbers are not the ones who are making
it a contest. It is the people, who, for some reason feel the need to keep
up rather than realizing that it's "all good". It really IS all good.

To quote "the Daddy", "Just get out there and 'box".

Respectfully,

-Kim (Rustypuff)


-----Original Message-----
From: Elizabeth [mailto:eizabethw19@yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 7:36 PM
To: letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [LbNA] Re: Well, I am impressed.


Wow! Very well written! I tend to see both sides of the fence so to
speak, and as someone in the less than 100 finds/plants group, I
would either need a ton of money for traveling or the ability to
move out to a state/area with more than a few randomly spread out
boxes to even come close to some of the outragous numbers I have
seen posted. So for me, it looks like I will always be bringing up
the rear... I am happy for all these people who have found/planted
so many boxes and they do have a right to brag about their numbers,
but with numbers like those, I often feel very inadaquate in the
letterboxing community "rat race". As for the drive-bys, I tend to
like having them, as long as it isn't every box out there. These
boxes are good for kids to learn the hobby and not be tired halfway
up the mountain, but I do wish there were more boxes with longer and
more involved trails. Letterboxing is what you make of it and there
should be no standards, other than respecting the nature around you
while you are on your boxing journey. Not only do letterboxES come
in all shapes ad sizes, letterboxERS do to. If drive-bys don't
appeal to you, just skip them. Ten mile hikes don't appeal to me
because I always have kids with me, so I just skip those altogether.
But hey, that's just my two cents.

Liz

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "allaboutthehike"
wrote:
>
>
> Well,
> I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am with the
> response to the PFX:500 club. What I am amazed with
> is that people still look at this whole thing as a
> contest. I guess the phrase "So what do I win?"
> when explaining this hobby to possible newbies will
> always rear it's ugly head. With numbers like 3000
> in Connecticut alone, 7000 finds, 100 finds in every
> state it's hard for a new person to "get" the whole
> concept of letterboxing. Especially when the
> "quintessential" letterboxers start competitions. Is
> it really still all about the hike or has it become
> something different? If that is the reality, then who
> are we to blame for this beautiful hobby becoming a
> stamp hoarding contest? Did the "founding fathers"
> mean for it to turn out this way? I think not. When
> did it start becoming all about the numbers? Remember
> when the person who had 13 boxes had the most in the
> U.S.? Has anyone ever READ the archives. Not looked
> at.....I mean READ. If this is the path that
> letterboxing is taking then maybe someone should "take
> the helm" so to speak, and bring back the old school
> methods. DRIVE BYES STINK. In case anyone beside me
> was wondering what the point of those are. Oh that's
> right....It's all about the numbers!!!!
>
> To the "higher ups": Stop scaring people away with
> dictating what the standards are. The are no
> "distinctions." We're all a bunch of wackos walking
> through the woods looking like we're lost. With 7000
> finds are you not one of the wackos anymore? If not,
> then what has it become for you? Playing a game
> shouldn't be like the rat race, should it?
>
> All about the hike






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Kim Calcagno"
wrote:
> ~Sigh~

(snip most remarkable post I've seen in a long time)

Stands up and gives wild applause.

Respectfully,

Warrior Woman
PFX500+ and I'm done counting
(and yes, that really is my sig line)

Well I have just found my very first box and I am in a competition with
my close friend (who I might add is outwitting me:) and we are rather
enjoying the fun we are making of it. I for one am into it being
somewhat of a game. That's my personal interest in it. I already LOVE
hiking and this just adds this fantastic dimension to it. not to
mention traveling - I cant wait to travel now!!!!!!! I applaud those
that have succeeded in finding any number of boxes. this is just about
the coolest thing I have ever seen - a real life adventure. I will
count every single one I find and brag about it! I think this rocks.

Warrior Woman wrote:

>
> --- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Kim Calcagno"
> wrote:
> > ~Sigh~
>
> (snip most remarkable post I've seen in a long time)
>
> Stands up and gives wild applause.
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Warrior Woman
> PFX500+ and I'm done counting
> (and yes, that really is my sig line)
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> What I am amazed with is that people still look at this whole thing
> as a contest.

I don't know--I haven't seen anyone make a post that suggested it was
"a contest". Some people are statistics people. They like to count
an analyze and there's nothing wrong with that, but they seem to do it
to challenge themselves, not as a competition against others.

How often do we see posts from people who write, "I found my first box
today and it was so much fun!!!"? We don't harp on them for counting
their finds, do we? They aren't bragging about their counts--they're
just happy about having something TO count.

Almost everybody can tell you what box was their 100th find because
it's like an anniversary of sorts. Kind of like telling something
you've been married for 50 years. It's an accomplishment and
something to be proud of, but that doesn't imply they're rubbing it in
because you've been divorced twice and have been on your third
marriage for a measily nine years. Come year number ten, they'll
probably congratulate you and say, "Good job! Ten years is a great
accomplishment!"

Wanda loves letterboxing and is probably more obsessive about it than
most of us (certainly myself!), but she's so supportive of other
letterboxers as well. Her PFX500 list is a nod of congratulations to
everyone that makes it on the list.

None of the posts I've seen have suggested that PFX counts are a
contest--until this one.

-- Ryan, who's also not a big fan of drive-by boxes, but different
strokes for different folks--I'm not complaining!

>
> I don't know--I haven't seen anyone make a post that suggested it
was
> "a contest". Some people are statistics people. They like to count
> an analyze and there's nothing wrong with that, but they seem to do
it
> to challenge themselves, not as a competition against others.
>
> How often do we see posts from people who write, "I found my first
box
> today and it was so much fun!!!"? We don't harp on them for
counting
> their finds, do we? They aren't bragging about their counts--
they're
> just happy about having something TO count.
>

Thanks for putting it so well. I totally agree.

We could not agree more with Ryan.

Letterboxing IS about the hike. Its also about the challenges -- like
figuring out Ray's Dilemma, like getting a special clue in the mail
from Drew Clan, and like the elation after finally finishing the 10
mile hike of "Quiet Corner".

Letterboxing is also about the numbers **to a certain extent**. When
you look at your PFX number, break it apart. We've met and exchanged
with over 100 fellow letterboxers -- each exchange has its own little
story -- and that is very near and dear to us. The F shows the
number of finds -- each indicative of a challenge we met (be it
terrain, clues, compass directions, etc.).

Every letterbox placed signifies a time commitment. Time taken to
carve the stamp, make the log, research the trail, place the box,
beta test the clues, put the clues on the web site.

People need to remember that this is NOT a contest and don't read
into someone including a PFX number somewhere as show-boating. Take
on the view point that the PFX number represents time, commitment,
dedication and passion for the support.

-Steve and Heidi in CT

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "allaboutthehike"
wrote:
>
>
> Well,
> I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am with the
> response to the PFX:500 club. What I am amazed with
> is that people still look at this whole thing as a
> contest.

Okay what "Rules" do you want to make?

There is plenty of room for PFX counts,Mystery boxes, Drivebys,hard
clues, easy clues, Spamps,an other assorted nuances of letterboxing.
Play the game the way you like, but let others play the way they
want.


Did the "founding fathers"
> mean for it to turn out this way? I think not. When
> did it start becoming all about the numbers?

You might want to check out the LBNA patches that have listings for
F counts. A link is located on the LBNA home page.

Don

Well said.

Steve and Heidi wrote:
We could not agree more with Ryan.

Letterboxing IS about the hike. Its also about the challenges -- like
figuring out Ray's Dilemma, like getting a special clue in the mail
from Drew Clan, and like the elation after finally finishing the 10
mile hike of "Quiet Corner".

Letterboxing is also about the numbers **to a certain extent**. When
you look at your PFX number, break it apart. We've met and exchanged
with over 100 fellow letterboxers -- each exchange has its own little
story -- and that is very near and dear to us. The F shows the
number of finds -- each indicative of a challenge we met (be it
terrain, clues, compass directions, etc.).

Every letterbox placed signifies a time commitment. Time taken to
carve the stamp, make the log, research the trail, place the box,
beta test the clues, put the clues on the web site.

People need to remember that this is NOT a contest and don't read
into someone including a PFX number somewhere as show-boating. Take
on the view point that the PFX number represents time, commitment,
dedication and passion for the support.

-Steve and Heidi in CT




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well, I AM impressed. What other people's high numbers signify to me
is a passion & commitment to something they love to do. As a new
letterboxer, I absolutely love this hobby & hope to continue to have
the same enthusiasm for years to come. I may never reach these high
counts, but I don't care & that's just me.

Mumma & Bunny Boy =)
P1 F26 HH1

And I just want to say a big "CONGRATULATIONS!" to everyone who has
reached 500, 1000 or even higher. Way to go you guys.


(letterboxingbee)

--Bev


who can only dream of getting to 500 here in southern Jersey!!